I have two Fedora systems, My firewall gateway running F6 and my local mail machine running FC3(!?!), on which I am getting ready to install F8. I am assuming that this evolution may not go all that smoothly, and I may need to ask folks of the sort found on this list, BUT I have genuinely had it with the drivel from Karl. Karl is a seriously damaged individual. I think he is not stupid, but he is one of the laziest people I have encountered in the nearly 25 years on the I have been "on" the net. He seems unwilling to do his own research into solutions for his problems from the extensive resources available on the net, and only after his own research fails to enlighten him ask for help for people on the fedora list by asking INTELLIGENT questions. I note that he seems to lack sufficient knowledge or accurate world view that would allow him to evaluate the advice he receives and to use the advice to solve his problem, Karl is certainly not unique; I have seen similarly equipped (?) twits, but Karl has exceptional persistence in his laziness. He seems unwilling to learn on his own, even partial solutions to his problems. He is however willing to heap abuse on people whose only "sin" is to offer solutions that he doesn't think will solve his problem or which do not solve the problems after his in-artful attempt to modify the advice he receives to fit it to his warped view of Linux. I know it has been tried before, but until he acknowledges Linux is not Windoze. So I am looking for a source of assistance should I need it from the net. My only requirement would be that the source be a "Karl Larson Free Zone". Do I have to set up my own? dlg