On Sun, 2006-11-26 at 12:21 -0500, Jacques B. wrote: > > I expect he's right on top of that, it would be out of character for Bruce > > if he got lax on that. The question is, is he the host, or is it some > > ISP equ to a box house thats hosting it? I haven't look the site up in > > whois myself, that may answer any doubts. > Personally I wouldn't weight in because I do not know enough on the > topic to take a firm position on it. And I do not have the time to > read the amount of information I'd need to read to feel I was at that > point. Some however will no doubt throw their name on a petition > without truly understanding what they are supporting. Others > certainly do and there is merit in their position. Hence why I (and > I'm sure others) take these petition (electronic or otherwise) with a > grain of salt. > > On the other note I immediately thought of the same thing, who owns > this site? A whois comes back to > > <snip of $whois techp.org> > Admin Name:Domain Administrator > Admin Organization:Computer ID > Admin Street1:1563 Solano Ave. > Admin Street2:PMB 349 > Admin City:Berkeley > Admin State/Province:California > Admin Country:US > > Is that Bruce Perens' (I have to say I am one of those who did not > know him) web site? The whois doesn't indicate that. I went to > wikipedia as suggested and found some info on him, including his web > site (assuming we can rely on that info) and a few other sites he has. > In quickly checking those I did not find that petition. One would > expect that if he had such a significant petition drafted up that at > minimum he'd link to it from his opening page on his web site. I > didn't note that (did I simply miss it?). > > And even if it is his petition, as pointed out if he is not the one > controling the site (hence what is done with the data collected), then > you cannot use his reputation to assertain how your personal/private > data will be handled. > > The process implemented is to try to give credibility to the #s being > produce (I am assuming/best guessing that to be the reason for > collecting that private data in order to sign the petition). That's > not a bad thing. > > Please yourself. Personally I sign no petition that I do not feel I > possess the knowledge necessary to adequately defend the petition's > position in a debate. And the issue of handling of my > personal/private information collected in the process of voicing my > opinion is obviously another concern. > > So sign it, or don't. But if you do make sure you are knowledgeable > enough to defend the petition's position. Otherwise it negatively > impacts the value of every signature on it. "If this person signed it > without really knowing what they were signing, how many other names on > this petition are in the same boat?" The comments left by those > signing can certainly shed light on a person's true knowledge of the > issue being debated. > > Signatures from the uninformed with comments demonstrating that > person's true lack of knowledge on issues surrounding a petition would > certainly present to the other side all kinds of ammunition to > discredit the petition as a whole. > > And good show of etiquette for labeling the subject line of this [OT]. > Much appreciated by those on this list I am certain. ---- as the originator of this thread, I note that I indeed labeled it as [OT] from its inception and didn't feel it necessary to debate the topic, only that people could sign or not sign on their own perogative. I would suggest that: 1 - you will note that at the bottom of the whois listing for techp.org is nameservers by perens.com. You will also note the same-ness of the above listing with the information listed at http://perens.com/Data/Contact.html 2 - Bruce Perens integrity and commitment to open source software is generally unquestioned. 3 - Bruce Perens is very much involved with security issues - I know that his 'ModelSecurity helper' application was one of the first mechanisms for providing granular security to Ruby on Rails. Check out his software contributions. Thus the predicate for not trusting the petition site as a means not to sign is easily solvable with only a little amount of detective work. As for not signing petitions that you don't understand, that's a blinding glimpse of the obvious. For those willing to invest time into acquiring necessary knowledge, I would also heavily recommend this fabulous multimedia record of a speech given by Lawrence Lessig (different but similar) at LinuxWorld this year... http://www.linuxworld.com/events/keynotes/lwsf06-lessig.html Craig
