On Sat, 2007-06-16 at 17:08 +0100, Timothy Murphy wrote: > Andy Green wrote: > > >> When I try the CLI command "alsamixer" instead > >> I get 19 (yes, 19) controls, > >> none of them properly labelled. > ... > >> Is there a simple introduction to Fedora sound somewhere? > > > > You're ranting about Alsa, not Fedora. All the other modern distros use > > Alsa too. > > That's no excuse. > I'm sure ALSA is technically far better than OSS, > but the user interface is unbelievably bad. > How can people put up with this? > > > The core trick to recording stuff is to understand that the default pane > > of controls in Alsamixer and kmix is only to do with playback. If in > > that pane you unmute Mic and turn it up, it will loop back the mic data > > from the mic channel to the output without recording anything. The > > usual result of that is howling feedback. > > > > What you want is in the second pane of alsamixer, which you get to with > > a Tab key, this deals with the input sources. You need to select a > > recording source by using the left/right arrow keys to navigate to it a > > space to enable it as an input source. In kMix its the same deal with a > > second tab pane having these controls and a circle above each source you > > click on to select. > > > > Sometimes what the driver reports about the mixer controls doesn't > > reflect reality. In these cases the wrong buttons and sliders do the > > wrong job. Most of the time though it does work after some meddling on > > your part. > > You fill me with hope, > but not with respect for ALSA. > > If Fedora, or any other distribution, choose to use ALSA > (without any alternative, as far as I can see) > then Fedora or whoever is responsible for the ensuing mess. > > Why should sound under Fedora be a hundred times more difficult > than setting up a DVD player, or a mobile phone? > > If Fedora is to have the slightest chance of success in the real world > then it must ensure that simple things like sound and printing > just work "out of the box. Hi, Tim, I see you are a mathematician. And that means you truly understand combinatorial issues, and exponential growth. Both of these impact the development of complex audio on PC's, and added to that is the combinatorial contribution of all the various interfaces. Your DVD player may be simple, but internally it has lots of options, and it only deals with the designers original choice of circuitry. That simplifies his task, reduces the impact that combinations of components, and combinations of use options adds to the mix. Moreover, his marketing input is to "Simplify the interface and give a good experience from pre-recorded media." Further simplifying his choices are the agreed upon standards for the media choices made. In addition, most of the programming is internal to the devices chosen. None of this reflects in your complaint about the interface, but it all should provide some perspective. Moreover, Fedora is "design edge" or "Bleeding Edge" development. It is intentionally an unrestricted environment, to empower users, developers and artists of the digital realm to explore and expand our experience. There are other Linux distributions with other goals. You, the user can choose the one which you feel best fits your needs. Moreover the choice has no cash costs associated. If you don't like one, download another. It's a choice. Alsa is a separate entity. Its interface is driven by its users and created by its designers and programmers. You can speak to them via their chosen list or website. They may even offer a different interface, or some new software that you can help evaluate and contribute to the community. We welcome your comments, and I am sure that others will hear of the issues you describe. But in reality this is an ALSA issue. There are many many documents on line and in books about Linux. Audio has many followers, from those creating new environments (check out Croquet), to those working to create virtual instruments, and some running on line "Jam sessions". You may find some of that interesting as well. It depends on your interests and perspective. Regards, Les H
