I haven't installed FC4 yet, I'm still on FC3. I'm not a Java kind of guy, and on the whole Emacs suits me very well as my development environment (I'm a web developer). However, I am curious to try out Eclipse's WTP (Web Tools Platform) and especially the WST (Web Standard Tools) subproject (I don't care about the JST -- I don't "do" J2EE). See: http://www.eclipse.org/webtools/ Does anyone know if they are included with FC4's Eclipse 3.1 package (I'm assuming that it's out on updates-released)? If they are, I'd be very interested to hear from anyone who has tried them out. Emacs has fabulous tools for working with SGML and XML, but frankly its PHP mode and Javascript mode are really crappy. As much as I love Emacs, if Eclipse's Web Tools are really good I could be tempted away, and it would be a very big incentive to upgrade to FC4. Best, Darren -- ===================================================================== D. D. Brierton darren@xxxxxxxxxxx www.dzr-web.com Trying is the first step towards failure (Homer Simpson) =====================================================================